Description

Il est originaire du Punjab. Il est arrivé au Canada en 1923, à l’âge de 19 ans. Il est retourné aux Indes en 1930 pour se marier, puis il est revenu au Canada avec son épouse. Aux Indes, sa famille vivait sur une ferme et il allait à l’école. Son père était au Canada depuis environ 1905.

Dès son arrivée au Canada, il a trouvé un emploi dans une scierie. Il raconte que les propriétaires des scieries appréciaient les travailleurs indiens parce qu’ils étaient costauds et ils faisaient ce que le patron leur demandait. Les Blancs n’aimaient pas travailler dans les scieries. Les travailleurs indiens habitaient dans des dortoirs et il y avait un cuisinier par 50 travailleurs, environ. Les travailleurs vivaient en harmonie et participaient à des activités sociales ensemble. Chaque nationalité avait son propre dortoir. Il y avait un syndicat en 1930, mais il n’avait pas beaucoup de pouvoir et les travailleurs cachaient la littérature envoyée par le syndicat afin que les administrateurs de la scierie ne sachent pas qu’ils s’intéressaient à la syndicalisation. Les syndicats sont devenus de plus en plus puissants d’année en année. Les Indiens s’entendaient bien avec les Chinois et les Japonais qui travaillaient dans la scierie, mais les Blancs ne les aimaient pas beaucoup. Les Blancs n’étaient pas violents envers eux, mais les Indiens étaient victimes de discrimination : certains restaurants refusaient de les servir, des barbiers refusaient de leur couper les cheveux ou ils ne pouvaient pas entrer dans les cinémas. A la scierie, il devait travailler dix heures par jour et il gagnait environ 0,35$ l’heure, qu’il jugeait être un bon salaire. Même dans les scieries appartenant à des propriétaires d’origine indienne, les Indiens avaient très peu de chances d’avancer et les postes de supervision étaient occupés surtout par des Blancs. Les Indiens avaient peu de contact avec la société à l’extérieur de la scierie, car plusieurs ne parlaient pas anglais. Il explique que les gens étaient très religieux à cette époque et qu’il y avait des Gurdwaras à Vancouver et à Victoria. Les Hindous et les Musulmans vivaient en harmonie. Il est heureux de vivre au Canada. Ses cinq enfants sont nés ici et ils ont tous des carrières satisfaisantes., [This transcript was created by optical character recognition (OCR) software and the accuracy depends on the quality of scanned images and complexity of original text.]

SIKHS IN CANADA
Interviewer: Professor, B. S.: Bolaria Department of Sociology

SIKHS IN CANADA

Time begin: 3:30
Language: The interview is going to be conducted in Punjabi.

B. S.: Bolaria(Interviewer) How old are you now?
Informant: I am 82
B. S.: How about your marriage now?
Informant: I was married in India, she lived 50 years but now passed away two years ago.
B. S.: How many children do you have?
Informant: I have five children. Three boys and two daughters.
B. S.: What part from India do you come from?
Informant: I am Kotali Than Singh, District, Jullundhur.
B. S.: So, from Punjab?
Informant: Yes, from Punjab.
B. S.: How old were you when you came here?
Informant: I was just about 19 years .
B. S.: Which year you came in?
Informant: In 1923.
B. S.: When you came, you were married then?
Informant: No, I was not. I went back after seven years and got married then.
B. S.: So, you got married in 1930?
Informant: Yes, sir.
B. S.: When you came back after you got married, did you bring your family with you?
Informant: Yes, I brought my wife with me.
page 2
B. S.: How about your work back in India? I mean in your village what was the condition of work or anything like that?
Informant: My family was doing the farming, but I did not do any farming I used to go to school, and afterwards I came here.
B. S.: How much education did you get when you were in India?
Informant: I finished my primary school.
B. S.: Oh, primary school, when you first came.
Informant: Yes.
B. S.: Why did you come here in Canada?

Informant: My father was here already, and he sent to me a letter from the immigration people. People used to come in these foreign countries, so I thought I should go and I would earn money.
B. S.: How did you come here?
Informant: I came through my father's letter.
B. S.: Which year your father came here?
Informant: I believe, he must have come in 1905i I am not sure about it.
B. S.: When you came here, what type of work did you find here first?
Informant: Here, usually people were working in the Saw Mills. So, I was working in the Saw Mills too with our people. I worked seven years in Canadian Lumber Companies.
B. S.: From 1923 to 1930? And in which Mill you were working at that time?
Informant: Yes, from 1923 to 1930 I worked in those Mills. I worked in Vancouver in the Dominion Saw Mill then Ko^chan Lake Hill Crescent Mill, Lumber Company, I worked in three four Companies.
B. S.: Just te.ll me that, when you used to work, what were the working conditions over there?
Informant: Those days the work was good, the white people were working in those Saw Mills, the Companies used to like our countrymen more, our people were stronger and used to work just the way Boss has told them to do. The white people did not like to work in the Mills those days. Our people were highly respected in the Saw Mills.
B. S.: And you know that many people were without their families, and how you used to live there, in the bunk houses?
Informant: In the past, they used to live in the bunk houses, they used to live in groups like 50 people sometimes 100 together, in our Frazer
Mill 500 people were living together. They used to keep the cook, he
page 3
used to cook a very good meal, there used to be a cook for 50 people in one group. They used to live together, and they had love for each other, they used to sing and beat the drums etc. there used to be the hustle and bustle in the camps.
B. S.: Just tell me that the bunks of Chinese, Japnese and East Indians, they were separate from one an other?
Informant: Yes, they were separate.
B. S.: And how about the White's?
Informant: Their's were separate too. Like we Singhs had the separate.
B. S.: So, you appointed your own cook?
Informant: Yes, we did.
B. S.: Now tell me that your wage was less than the Whites?
Informant: Our wage was usually more compare to the white people, then the govt. made the law at one time, they fixed the rate for 40 cents an hour, but we had already 40 cents an hour, so with that law or the rate we people had the disadvantage. The white people did not like working in the Saw Mills, our people were getting more wage than the white people. Canadian Companies used to help us living in Canada, although the people here did not like us but the Companies liked us very much. Our people were very hard working .
B. S.: Yes, they used to work very hard. Were you the member of the Union/ was there any Union at that time?
Informant: In 1930 the Unions were coming up very slowly, but there was not any successful Union, they did not have that much power, at that time people who were the members they used to put their bags of papers in the pockets so that the Mill people wouldn't know that, I mean so that the Companies would not know about it, so the unions did not have the ; power that time. Later on, every year they they were getting powerful.
B. S.: You tell me that -902: other people like Chinese and Japnese who were working there and the white people too, how they were treating our East Indian?
Informant: That time Chinese and Japnese were many who were working with us, there were not many white people working in the Mills, we had good relations with them, but the white people living there they used to hate us little bit.
B. S.: Yes, tell me you used to have any kind of problem going to the restaurants or any places like that?
Informant: I did not have any problem but usually, people used to say that they do not allow them to go to the restaurants or some other places like that, they even did not like to cut our hair, they used to hate us,but in the Companies we did not have any discrimination.
page 4
B. S.: You could go to the cinemas?
Informant: Many times, they did not allow us going in the cinemas.
B. S.: When you used to go, they used to tell you that you sit on separate seats?
Informant: Many times,they used to tell you, if you were wearing the turban, that you sit on the next seat. So, that was the common complaint.
B. S.: Tell me, I came to know that the ferry which used to runofrom Vancouver and Niniamo, they used to tell our people that you travel at the bottom level, is that right or not?
Informant: No, I believe it is not, we used to come to Vancouver, there used to be 50 people who used to go with us because we liked singing the religious songs (Kirtan) and the Harrow Lumber Company used to senfi us / on their own bus to Vancouver. But I am not sure about this that they ^ used to tell our people to travel sitting on the ground.
B. S.: When you came here first, how many hours you had to work daily?
Informant: We had to work 10 or 12 hours. Usually the Mills used to run ten hours, some times there were over times in the Mills.
B. S.: How much the wage at that time?
Informant: I believed they increased to 35 cents later on but it was not much.
B. S.: You were satisfied with your job that time?
Informant: In my opinion, I thought I made very good money.
B. S.: Tell me that our people used to get the promotion or they just have the white people foreman?
Informant: Our people had hardly any chance (less chance) the Company in which I was working the boss was our own people I was working the grading work, but usually, our people had not that much chance to become a foreman. They used to just work in the Mills but they were not used to get work as foreman or things like that.
B. S.: They used to put you for outside work or inside too?
Informant: No, I don't think so. They used to put you on the work you were capable to.
B. S.: Like you know that when we go out sometimes one says Paki, but at that time they used to say the things like that to our East Indians?
Informant: I nwver heard of that.
B. S.: What they used to say us, Hindus?
page 5 Informant: Yes, Hindus.
B. S.: You used to meet just with the East Indians or you used to meet meet other people too?
Informant: We used to meet our East Indians only, there were very few educated ones may be they had contacts with the white people. But usually people did not know the language (English) may be just few one out of hundred, so we did not have our contacts with outside people.
B. S.: Tell me that our Sikhs had any facilities regarding religion, like they had the Gurdawara that time, where you used to go?
Informant: When I came they had the Gurdawara in Victoria and in Vancouver too. In that age the Sikhs had so much love for Gurbani. Around Canada there used to be four or five Jorre Melas (religious gathering) there used to be the big hustle and bustle on all those religious gathering. If it was in Vancouver, the Victoria people used to go there, we used to collect'the money too for'that tpusrpose* and used to come back via Duncan and people had so much love for each other.
B. S.: How about Hindus and Muslims at that time, I mean the dealings with each other?
Informant: I don't think there was any difference. All of them used to live togather with care and love for one another. I did not hear anything of that they had disunity with each other all used to live with care and had love for one another.
B. S.: You said the Unions came in 1930, you think our Indians were the members of those Unions too? They were active in the Unions?
Informant: Yes, when the Unions came these members used to tell us that you should become the members so, our people used to take part in those Unions. Because our people used to think that if we would not become the members may be they would kick us out of work tomorrow.
B. S.: When your whole family came here, your contacts were limited to the Indians or you developed your relations with other peopie too?
Informant: Our relations stayed with the Indians but our children being Canadian born, used to go to school with the white people or things like that then our relations developed with the white people too. Our children had friends and they used to come at our place.
B. S.: Are you involved politically in Canada?
Informant: No, I am not.
B. S.: You tell me when we come from our country we all have the desires or aspirations, you think your dreams are fulfilled here?
Informant: Dreams mean, our desires/
B. S.: Yes, that is right.
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Informant: Yes, they are fulfilled, we have five children and all five have very good living well settled. My son used to be the foreman in the Mill, we used to have our company too and 15 or 30 white people used to work for us too, so, because of the Company our children used to think about business. Now, my children are very well off.
B. S.: So, you think it was good you came here and you made a right decision?
Informant: Yes, that is right. I think we were lucky, we are one of the best now children are very good at their place.
B. S.: You think your children have a good futur here in Canada?
Informant: In my opinion it is good here.
B. S.: It is better compare to us?
Informant: Yes, it is.
B. S.: Now I don't think I am going to ask any question, but you think there is any other thing or question which I did not ask regarding your work
Informant: I think there is not anything left which I want to say, I am very thankful to you.
B. S.: The Interview ends around 3:50, OK Ji thank you very much.