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Title: Interview of Anne Vernon, 1; 2
Description: Anne Vernon March 9 2011; June 29 2011 Born: Anne Leith Fraser, July 16, 1926 in Lanarkshire, Scotland. Born at a home called Balgownie. One brother, William (Bill) Fraser. Very good at sports as a young boy; he was the only male descendant on the Fraser line, and was quite favoured as a result. During the War, the headmaster told their mother that
Show moreAnne Vernon March 9 2011; June 29 2011 Born: Anne Leith Fraser, July 16, 1926 in Lanarkshire, Scotland. Born at a home called Balgownie. One brother, William (Bill) Fraser. Very good at sports as a young boy; he was the only male descendant on the Fraser line, and was quite favoured as a result. During the War, the headmaster told their mother that he should be sent away, as they lived so close to the docks in Glasgow, “a magnet for young boys”. He went to Keil Boarding School and did well there, playing cricket, rugby and golf. Served in the Army. Worked at the Lochrin Iron Works for a time. Married a woman named Penny in what was then Rhodesia, and had 2 sons and 1 daughter. They live in South Africa at the time of interview. When Anne was 17, she “ran off” and joined the “wrens” (Women’s Royal Naval Service, WRNS). She attended training in Mill Hill in London. She describes playing on the carts used for transporting wire in the family business as a child. She describes how jobs were held for people when they left for the War. Anne attended school at age 5, and found it “very difficult”. She remembers playing sports with all the boys in the fields off the avenue she lived on. At age 11, she went to Parks School (all girls) in Glasgow. She played field hockey, tennis, and swam. She left school at age 16 because her brother was going to boarding school, and signed up to join the “Rens”. She had started by volunteering, sending packages to Prisoners of War held in Germany. The packages were mostly clothes (socks), as well as canned goods. Her cousin was a lorry driver for the Army, which encouraged her to find her own path and join the Wrens instead. She had been trained as a typist after leaving school at Glasgow Commercial College, which was her lifelong career to an extent. She is unsure why she didn’t choose the Airforce, as her favourite Christmas gift as a child had been a model airplane set. She has always had an interest in engineering and architecture. After being trained in Mill Hill, she was posted to Chatham, Kent, and later to Gillingham. She served in the North Tower; D-Day had come and gone. Anne and other ladies in the Wrens would go into London to see ballet and theatre with actors like Alan Klunz. They served 24 hours on, 24 hours off. She met a man (“Kit”) and eloped with him in Scotland. Mother: Maiden name Leith, from Aberdeen, Scotland. Maternal Grandfather: Leith. Licenced grocer of some repute, large shop on Union Street in Aberdeen, served on the Police Board. Maternal Grandmother: Anne (Annie) Anderson. Died before Anne was born. When Anne was doing market research for the Scottish government in the north, her grandmother was remembered as a gentle, elegant lady by people 30+ years after her death. Father: Alan Inglis Fraser. Born 1898/99. Had 3 sisters. He had “ran away” with a friend age 16 to join the First World War. Member of the Lovat Scouts. He rode a motorcycle as a dispatch rider. His friend was injured in the trenches on his 15th birthday. In 1938, travelled to the States to look for the latest thing in wire machinery, because it was known that another War was coming. His father ran Lochrin Iron Works. Passed at age 43, when Anne was 16. Had spleen issues. Several people in the same age group who had served in the trenches with him passed suddenly around the same time. Paternal Grandmother: Born in New Elgin; her mother had been widowed early on in life, and remarried. Met in Alan’s father in Johnson’s Sawmill. Life was tough at that time; you had to walk everywhere in Elgin. Paternal Grandfather: William Fraser. From Lochrin, family of 12 boys. Worked at Lochrin Iron Works, and eventually became managing director, until government officials took over the company upon his death. Married in Edinburgh. Anne was working as a fundraiser for children impacted by violence until shortly before this interview. Ex-Husband: Bertram “Kit” William Ernest Wells. Mother from somewhere near Fife/Arbroath; she would claim her father was a Pirate. She was a Plymouth Brethren. Kit was a “naval type” who worked in Communications. Kit went out to Malta in the 1950’s and Anne followed him. They were stationed there for 2 years and had 2 children; a boy and a girl (Tory & Patricia). Things were too difficult and they were not working out, and the station in Malta was being shut down. Anne describes the political state of Malta at the time. There was a large religious presence in the area. After returning to Scotland, Anne left Kit, and moved in with her mother, along with the 2 children. Anne returned to college to upgrade, and went back to work in various offices in Glasgow to support her family, while her children attended school locally. She received a small monthly pay from the Navy. She would travel about 12 miles into Glasgow by train or bus. Anne describes how it was common for people to drink “whiskey and water” in their teenage years; when you were an adult, you were given “sippers” – a straight shot of whiskey. Binge drinking meant many people did not survive their 21st birthdays. Anne would attend shows at Green’s Play House in Glasgow by herself as a young woman. She had been introduced to classical music in school and loved it. She was also a fan of jazz. She would have to sneak out because her grandmother was quite strict, though her mother approved. She recalls going ice-skating as a child. Anne went for a drink in Glasgow with her brother Bill in Feb. 1956. She remembers the students were collecting cans and coins for the local hospitals. Bill introduced her to some student friends of his, which is where she met her husband Gavin Vernon. He stayed in a house called “The Hovel”, just off Great Western Road. They were married Dec 26, 1960, in Coatbridge. Husband: Gavin Harold Russell Vernon. Born in Kintore (outside Aberdeen) August 11, 1926. At age 3 & ½, he visited his paternal grandparents with his mother. His grandfather was a minister with the Church of Scotland. In the time they were away, his father sold his practice and joined the P&O as a surgeon doctor. Gavin worked in for BICC (British Insulated Callender’s Cables) electrifying the railway from Airdrie to Glasgow. He was an electrical engineer and eventually got his degree from the University of Glasgow. He had attended Strathallan Boarding School from age 11 on. He had a great sense of humour and was very clever. He loved school. He was “called up” to the military at 17¼, and served in the Army at the Perth barracks. He served in Palestine. His best memory of his time there was pulling oranges right off the trees. He was later stationed in Cyprus, before returning to Glasgow and attending university. During the summer, the undergraduates had to take summer jobs related to their discipline. He often worked as a troubleshooter for Glasgow Transport. He commuted from Glasgow to London for work for a long time. Gavin worked in Egypt and in Saudi Arabia as a contractor later in life. Gavin never belonged to any particular political party. Father: Harold Russell Vernon. One of 4 boys and 1 girl. Father was a minister at Arbuthnott. Country doctor & surgeon. Lived with his new wife in Turnberry. Gavin only saw his father around 3 times from age 3 to 20, though he paid his school fees once. Mother: Catherine Jean MacGregor. Born in Dalhousie in the late 1800s, where her father was the estate factor. Taught a boarding school for girls from age 16 to 21, until she became a nurse. Youngest Theatre Sister in Scotland in her time. Ran the Edinburgh Infirmary Nursing Home during the War. Anne tells the story of when she heard the War was over, the night of “V-Day”. She had been attending a film with a friend from the Wrens in Gillingham, when an announcement came over the speakers: the War in Europe was over. They followed the crowd onto the trains into London, and were separated due to the number of people. She was in front of the Buckingham Palace when Churchill and the Royal Family appeared outside. Anne remembers Churchill stepping out on a balcony with a cigar, waving and giving the “victory” sign. She missed the last trains out of town, and she ended up spending the night. Two guards let her tour the War Room and she saw the red phone Churchill had used. Anne talks about how many high ranking officers of the Second World War had served as junior officers in the First World War, which may have been to their benefit. Gavin had sent for a job application in northern Scotland, and was refused after 1000 people applied in the same day. He immediately went down to the Consulates offices; first to the American Consulate, where he found the service was rude, and then to the Canadian Consulate, where he was greeted kindly and given an application form. Canada was looking for engineers. He came to Toronto in June of 1963, then took a train to Regina, Saskatchewan. They were going to start liquid mining for pot ash, something completely new. Anne sold the flat they owned in West Glasgow, and flew with her two children to Canada. She was astounded by the weather in Regina. She would start a garden in May, and had harvested two crops by September, when they travelled to Vancouver. Gavin was let go from the mine, and called H. A. Simons for a job in Vancouver. Gavin never technically adopted the children from Anne’s first marriage, but they attended their parent’s wedding, and had their last names changed to Vernon. Anne and Gavin rented a home in North Vancouver. Gavin travelled first by rail, and Anne followed in the car, with the kids, their belongings, two cats and two dogs. Anne got a job at Bell Irving. She also worked for the Federal Government as a secretary for the Department of Transport. Anne found out she was pregnant again at age 42, when Gavin was at work in Maine. She gave birth to their son, also named Gavin. He attended Waldorf School in Vancouver. H.A. Simons gave Gavin “an offer he couldn’t refuse”, and he accepted a job in Czechoslovakia. In the meantime, Anne offered her services as a typist in exchange for an architect to do the planning on their home renovations. Gavin did all the electrical design on the home. Anne followed with young Gavin, flying into Prague from London. Gavin attended school in Vienna. Anne worked part-time for H.A. Simons in the local mill while they were in Czechoslovakia. Young Gavin was relocated to Strathallan School. The family lived in Aberdeen for a time. They still owned the house in Vancouver. Gavin worked in France for a time, as well as Holland and Saudi Arabia. She laughs that their furniture has crossed the Atlantic 3 times. Gavin Vernon’s famous removal of the Stone of Scone from Westminster Abbey in London on Christmas Day, 1950, started in Glasgow, while he was a university student. They bought a car – Gavin, Ian Hamilton, Allen Stuart in one, and Kay Matheson transported the larger piece in her car. The students were members of the Scottish Covenant Association. Anne says that the film on the event was fairly accurate, although it left a few moments out. The border was closed between Scotland and England at that time. The stone was broken at the time – they planned to put the pieces back together with a copper pipe. When they heard the Queen Mother was going to make a call out for the return of the stone, Gavin said it was enough, and left the stone at Arbroath Abbey, before notifying the police and media. The incident had sparked a manhunt across the country. They were never charged. Gavin and Kay spoke a little Gaelic; a police officer understood them speaking to each other. The movie based on the event was called The Stone of Destiny. Anne describes it as a “prank that lifted people’s spirits”. The War had made life difficult and dull, and the event gave the Scots “something to think about”. Anne talks about the modern push for independence in Scotland. Gavin went into hospital Jan. 26, 2004, at which point he learned he had inoperable lung cancer. He fought with radiation treatment, and chose to live his final days at home. He had the Burns Supper organization run his memorial services. He passed away March 19, 2004. In the years since Gavin’s passing, Anne has been involved in Elder’s College, attending and arranging classes on a wide range of subjects that interest her. She volunteered with the Westminster Historical Society, publishing a newsletter.
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Date: 2011-03-09, 2011-06-29

Title: Interview of John Buchanan
Description: John Buchanan Feb. 18 2015 Born: John Buchanan, on May 26, 1939, in the family home in Shettleston, Glasgow. Only child, oldest grandchild on both sides. They lived in a tenement building with no hot water. Father: Born in Bridgton, Glasgow in March 1915. Worked manual labour. A large steel company in his area had relocated to a town called Corby,
Show moreJohn Buchanan Feb. 18 2015 Born: John Buchanan, on May 26, 1939, in the family home in Shettleston, Glasgow. Only child, oldest grandchild on both sides. They lived in a tenement building with no hot water. Father: Born in Bridgton, Glasgow in March 1915. Worked manual labour. A large steel company in his area had relocated to a town called Corby, England and he relocated there for work around age 17 or 18. It was called “little Scotland” due to the number of Scots who moved there. He worked for a time in Blochairn, Glasgow in steel products, immediately before World War Two. Neither he nor his brother who worked there were allowed to enlist in the War initially, as they were considered essential workers. He later worked as a fireman in the Merchant Navy on the North Atlantic Run, until about 1946. Near D-Day, his ship (the S.S. Wallace Rose) was loaded with munitions, and had to be towed out of a minefield. He was mentioned in the dispatch, without his knowledge. Burned his feet badly during his time in the Navy. He worked as a shunter for a time after the Navy, as well as in a market in Glasgow, and did odd jobs such as newspaper delivery to earn money. He then got a job as a steelworker. He immigrated to Canada in 1957, qualified as a steel director. Kitimat was meant to be the new aluminum capital of the world, but the provincial government vetoed the project, and the workers ended up in Vancouver. He chose to stay, and was involved in several large jobs, such as in the airport hangar. Dennis Gladstone was a friend of his who worked on the Second Narrows Bridge. He retired in 1965. Paternal Grandmother: Maiden name Jemima MacGrath, from south side of Glasgow. She was Catholic, which caused controversy with the Protestant Buchanan family. Paternal Great-Grandfather: Buchanan, came from Ireland. Protestant. Mother: Maiden name Frew. She followed her husband to Canada in 1958. She travelled over by plane, and John stayed on his own in Scotland. Maternal Grandfather: Tommy Frew, from Lanark. Family owned a surface pit. Had a brother and sister; Tommy worked the pit, mining for coal with his father and brother. The brother moved to Buffalo, New York, and sister moved to Falkirk (Glasgow). Maternal Grandmother: Sarah Simpson, from east end of Glasgow. John stayed with his grandmother on many weekends. She was a big stout woman, with a slight, small husband. They were deeply religious and had six children. Maternal Great-Grandfather: William Simpson, slater & plasterer. He lived with his daughter Sarah, and would babysit John as a child. He had another daughter named Jeanie, who had married a well-off man and never had children. John was closer with his mother’s side growing up, although he had Sunday dinners and the odd gathering with his Buchanan family. John jokes he was the “perennial dunce” of the class. He attended Eastbank Academy for primary school, which also had a reputable secondary school. The school used a streaming system, and as he was more interested in soccer (football) than school, he was not in the academic stream. He left school at 15, which was normal. He may have been at a disadvantage, as he was nearly six months younger than many of the children in his class. His first (and favourite) teacher was Ms. MacKenzie. John played soccer at a junior professional level until around age 20. It gave him quite a bit of prestige in the area, being published in local newspapers. He played for the Maryhill Juniors. John and his wife moved into Canada House on May 26th, planning to make a move to Canada; they were allowed to immigrate June 6th, 1960. They rented a small place at 16th & Main. John worked night shift as a cleaner in the Vancouver General Hospital, then later applied with MacMillan-Bloedel, off of Marine Drive & Fraserview Golf Course. He worked for 6 months making sheets of plywood. They returned to Scotland for 3 years, and “grew up” in terms of economic responsibility. Upon return, an Amnesty was declared: those born after the 1st of June, 1939, didn’t have to serve the mandatory 2 years in the Army if they completed a five year apprenticeship instead. His apprenticeship was in the shipwright trade, but he was days short on completing it. Technology had taken over so much of the trade that by the time his apprenticeship ended, it was essentially useless. The shipyards in Scotland were also declining, and still producing ships with technology from the 1930’s. “Britain was going to Hell in a handbasket, and Vancouver became more appealing”. He worked as a carpenter in high-rises, then worked as a door-to-door salesman for 8 or 9 months, reselling “soft goods”. He learned many tactics to “get a foot in the door”. He compared it to milking a cow. He then started his own business as a window cleaner. He learned what people were paying for potatoes, and figured it would make a good business, so he sold them along with his window treatments. His wife also worked and had a very good income. They went into a bank and were denied, and that was when they decided to return to Canada. Moving to Vancouver: They ultimately moved in 1964. Areas like Burnaby were appealing to new immigrants, as they had lots of space. John worked for American Building Maintenance Company on Hastings as a window cleaner, and was laid off after two weeks after the contract was cancelled. He was recommended as a substitute for two weeks to the Burrard building, and ended up staying on for 2 years. He was also the assistant coach for one of the provincial soccer teams; a player named Gary Thompson asked him to inquire about scholarships. John phoned around to the newly created Simon Fraser University, and was passed onto the Athletic Director. He was told there was no plan for a soccer department. A year later, Blaine called Jack, and asked him whether he would like to work as the Pool Manager. John had no experience with pool managing or PDP (teacher training), but after talking it over with his wife, he accepted the position. He had never met anyone that had attended University, and so it was a “great adventure”. He began work with SFU on May 1st 1966. He started in the “bottom ranks”, and took a pool management course. He was surprised to find that the academics he encountered were not very different from other folks. Many people in Recreation were overworked, and there was a “trickle-down” effect in the ranks. However, he became one of the team quickly. The school was expanding quickly, and he became the Equipment Manager, which expanded with the creation of the Kinesiology Department, under Dr. Eric Bannister. PDP became part of the Education department, and a Recreations department was created. John became Equipment Manager for Athletics & Recreational Services, which serviced both realms. He became a union member at this point, which made a substantial change to working conditions & money (early 1970’s). He had often volunteered to assist with Intramural sports. John was taken out for lunch by Dr. Martin Henday at the Caribou Pub, and was asked to work as the Assistant Manager of Recreation. It was an “astronomical leap”. He then became the Manager of the Department of Recreation, which was possible since it was not an academic department. He says today, he wouldn’t get in the front door. It became a large enterprise, getting into summer camps and more. There were very few Recreational activities geared at women to start. John explains that there was a large fuss about women “ruining their hair” with recreation in the 1960’s, which fell away when the popularity of fitness rose in the 1970’s. John began the SFU Soccer Program in 1966 as a Club, through to 1974 when it became a Varsity sport. When it was a club, it was open to all members of the University, including faculty. They played in the Pacific Coast League. He was Head Coach of the team until 1980, and they won a national championship, as well as a Rose Bowl. He was never a full-time coach as he had his job in Recreation, and so he wasn’t paid for this work. He became involved with the North American Soccer League in 1974, as well as a staff coach with the Canadian Soccer Association. He wound up Assistant Coach at the 1978 Olympics. In 1981, the Departments of SFU shifted again, and John was forced to choose between coaching and his position in Recreation. Career-wise, it was an easy choice to retain his Recreation job, as he had a young family at home. To the credit of the people who followed him, SFU Soccer still remains to the time of the interview. They’ve just recently hired the 5th coach of their 50 year span. John was able to do a lot of travelling with the team. In 1983, he left his position at the Department of Recreation. During his time, SFU produced more players for the North American Soccer League than any other University program. He made the “fatal mistake” of picking up a set of golf clubs, and Jack Westover, a golf coach at SFU, convinced him to help with reorganizing the program from 1985-1990. Jack went away to qualify for the LPGA and “essentially never came back”. John took the team to the NAIA National Championships 13 times in the next 11 years. John stepped away as the coach. The Golf Program was shut down by the Athletic Director in 2005, after fluctuations in funding. The money spent on Golf was minimal, but it “looked good on paper” to have it cut. Michael Stevenson was upset about the loss, and used the NC2A negotiations as an opportunity to bring the program back, as well as a Women’s golf program. A new Athletic Director was appointed. They asked John to return, but he refused. They are ranked 8th nationally in the NC2A in 2015, out of 200 schools. It can be difficult to recruit women to the team, as they don’t have the same scholarship money to offer as other schools. John was the first inductee into the SFU Hall of Fame in the 1980’s. He was inducted into the Canadian Soccer Hall of Fame in 2010. In 2013, he received an award from Simon Fraser, and in 2014 he received the Chancellor’s Award. It was an honour. He remembers a stranger told him before he took the job at SFU, “A new university is like a new village, it grows”. Wife: Josephine Robson. Met at a dance hall in Scotland, The Glasgow Pally. John fancied the redhead he spotted dancing, who spent some time hiding from him. They were both 17; they had their first date when he was 18, and were married at 20. She passed away in 2004. Father: Joseph Robson, worked in the forge. Mother: Susan, lived to age 91. Her parents came from Ireland. She had an Uncle killed in the First World War. Josephine was 1 of 8: 6 sisters and 2 brothers. Another sister also immigrated to Canada. The oldest daughter Netta is still alive in Parkhead, Glasgow, Scotland at time of interview, and aged 76. The family was Catholic, but a sister named May “broke the ice” by marrying a Navy man who was Protestant. They were a strict family prior to that, and Joseph had cousins in town he had never met because they had been disowned. Miners would show up for “a pitch and toss” and would scrap each other. Their father, Joseph was known to show up to any fight he was paid for. John discusses the tensions between Catholics and Protestants in Scotland at the time. He feels the Catholic Church brought some segregation on itself by pushing for separate school systems. In his upbringing, he went to Sunday school and attended the Church of Scotland. He was also a member of the Life Boys until age 13. He played soccer with the YMCA until age 16. He stopped attended church as a teen, but was married in the same church he was baptised in. His wife was willing to be married in the Protestant church. It was at times an economic decision, as many Protestant men had good jobs through their connections. For example, John’s grandfather was a Freemason, which helped him get a job at the local shipyard. These connections happened without John’s knowledge at the time. His father was also a Master in the Freemason’s Lodge. John first chose to leave Scotland because he was going to be enlisted in the Army. They had to “tiptoe” through immigration, as the police were on the lookout for deserters. Prestwick was the point of departure, and John was the last person to get on the plane. The stewardess asked him to step aside, and he was sure he was going to be caught, but she was actually upgrading them to First Class. They were only here 13 months before returning to Scotland, at which point there was an amnesty put in place where an apprenticeship could take the place of army service. He left the second time for a better life; 40% of the population at that time lived in tenement buildings. John became involved in Simon Fraser University Pipe Band by another happy accident. George Pedersen was the President at the time; a man called Dennis Roberts was the first Information Officer for the University, and was a Scot. He formed the first pipe band to play on behalf of SFU. They put on a performance, and John inherited the equipment from this. Pederson called up John and consulted him as the “expert” on bagpipes – since John was from Scotland. He jokes, “I’m from Glasgow, not from Scotland”. Pederson had many ideas about highlighting the Scottish link in the school’s namesake, which got John’s imagination going. It was agreed that if there were to be a Pipe Band, it would have to be worthy of representing what was then a $200 million dollar institution claiming Scottish heritage. They went forward with that plan; John phoned the Scottish Cultural Association and the BC Piper’s Association; at that time there were only 3 bands in the area – Victoria Place, Triumph Street, and Port Moody. He called Jimmy McMillan, who strongly recommended the Lee brothers, Terry and Jack. As a coach, John was looking for organization & discipline, which they carried. Dr. Ian MacGregor was the Director of Recreation, and worked with John on forming the band and acquiring the brothers. Terry Lee is in the Highland apparel business, and was able to provide information on the cost and standards of dress in bagpiping competitions. The bill to outfit the band at that time was $10000. When John presented the invoice to be approved, he was met with shock, but two weeks later it was approved. The Pipe Band was ultimately part of an attempt to rebrand the school’s image overall, as it struggled with being called “the high school on the hill”, and was considered to be full of “Socialists and Communists”. The Scottish culture became more central to the identity of Simon Fraser University. Martin Henday was able to acquire scholarships for players, which continue to 2015. John was responsible for administration of the band. Once it began to gain prestige, people began to question why the band fell under Recreation rather than Ceremonies, and the change was made. He feels it was “the best ten thousand dollar investment Simon Fraser ever made”. John recalls a time they hosted a Highland Dance competition through Recreation, which was a great success. He was also involved in the 25th Anniversary celebrations of SFU, in which they hosted a Highland Games. It was difficult to charge admissions, as the university could not be closed off; they ran into some other issues, and the plans were ultimately cancelled in favour of the publication of an anniversary coffee table book. John never experienced blatant discrimination based on being a Scottish immigrant in Canada; however, he did hear from an uncle back home that those who chose to emigrate were “deserting the ship” instead of staying to improve things. The same uncle (Jacky) ultimately settled in Australia. He was actually John’s favourite relative, as he was only 12 years older than John. He says it’s common for family back in Scotland to think “you left, and that’s it” – “a subtle alienation”. He still visits some of his mother’s family when in Scotland, usually every 4 years. He and his wife learned not to speak much of their life in Canada, as it could come across as bragging. John has a new grandson named Johnathan Hamish Zen Buchanan (a tribute to Scottish heritage father and Japanese heritage mother). John was a huge fan of Scottish comedians like Billy Connelly, and often played records for his son growing up. Looking back on his life, John would improve his education; it lost him an opportunity to be a Director at SFU. John had spoken to a nephew living in Troon about the referendum for Scottish independence, and found he was very much in favour of it. There seemed to be a divide between the younger and older generations on that issue in John’s experience.
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Date: 2015-02-18

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