Interview of Hamish and Isla Robertson

June 18 2005 (Isla Clark and James Robertson) Isla Mary Clark Robertson (Montgrew Farm, Keith, Banffshire, 1 September 1940, her name comes from the river Isla in the North East, not the place). She has an older brother, Ian, and two older sisters, Audrey and Josephine-Jessy, a younger sister, Wilma Mackay, and younger brother, Alastair. Her father was William Clark (Fortry Farm, Grange, Banffshire, May 12, 1912). He came from a family of six: James, George, John, Alexander, Elizabeth, and then himself. A lot of them joined the police force. He was a farmer's son and was tipped to take over the farm, but there was a disagreement and he therefore ended up working on different farms. He then signed up to the Territorial Army and called up to the Seaforth Highlanders during WWII, he stayed in army until 1951. He then worked for the laird of Ballindalloch for a year, they got their own place called Delchirach and stayed there until his son took it over. They retired to the old station house in Ballindalloch. They were a quite a devout, Church of Scotland Protestant family. He sang in the choir and became known as the "Bothy Ballad King" of the North East, he was recorded by Hamish Henderson, who was collecting songs for the Scottish Studies Department of Edinburgh University. (Link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bothy-Ballads-Northeast-Various-Artists/dp/B000…). Her mother was Josephine Robb MacKay (Montgrew Farm, Keith, Banffshire). She came from a Catholic family, but they were not all that religious. A story goes that a Catholic priest was chased out of the house, either by the grandfather, who might have had a drinking problem, or by the grandmother, who was not prepared to have any more children! Her brother played the fiddle. None of them were into bagpipes, but they did enjoy the Highland Games. She stayed at Fort George, Inverness, during the war. She said it was a great place to be as a child, they woke up to the bagpipes every morning and were able to "run wild". She went to school there with children from all over Scotland and some from England. She then lived in Ardersier on the Moray Firth until she was 11, and then went to Corglass, Knockando, which is now a wind-farm. While there she went to Aberlour school and then moved to Ballindallich. She then left to go to Edinburgh after high school and worked in the Scottish Records Office for two years. Her job entailed delivering bound volumes of records to Sir James Fergusson of Kilkerren, the Keeper of the Records of Scotland. After a year she learnt polyography and became the reader indexer of records, she was chosen because she was the only one who knew how to read Latin. But she decided to become a teacher instead and signed up for teacher-training at Murrayhouse, Edinburgh, and was given a grant for college because Scotland was in desperate need for teachers, she was there for 3 years. After college, she taught at a school in Easterhouse, Glasgow, "a slum clearance area with not a lot of facilities", and then Saracen Primary School. She remembers discipline (i.e. the belt) and "respect" towards the teacher (i.e you didn't question their decisions/judgements) being a big part of the Scottish education experience when she was both a child and a teacher herself. After this, she emigrated to Montreal with her husband, James, to teach at Maisonevue School and remembers a "fantastic difference" in the attitude of the children towards the teacher (she doesn't specify what, but no doubt it was something to do with less harsh discipline and less deference. When she first came, she had to do two years probationary work in Quebec to get a permanent teaching certificate. She left Canada to go back to Scotland, had a child, and became a stay-at-home mum for a while. She then returned to Canada and she became a substitute teacher for a while. One of the reasons she came to Canada was so her children wouldn't be brought up in Scotland's sectarian mess. She remembers Paisley was a real eye-opener in terms of bigotry. Even the nurseries were separated along religious lines, she remembers walls being built. She also worked for the Victoria Order of Nurses for two years as a care assistant. She remembers caring for a 92 year old Scottish lady who was from Peebles, she became very fond of her and found it hard to cope with her death. She then took a secretarial course at Capilano College 1980 and subsequently got a job as a stenographer and then a PA to the Consul General and the British Consulate and stayed in this employment until retirement. She thinks that British Columbia has inherited a class-consciousness from its British roots, although it's moderated somewhat by a monetary-class-consciousness from America rather than a social one. She got involved in Sons of Scotland in West Vancouver– her roles included being a Treasurer, a standard bearer, and chief of the Seaforth Camp in North Vancouver. She also joined the Moray, Nairn and Banff Society and later became the society's president. Around the early 1990s both this society and the Caledonian Society were fading away (lack of membership, money, drive). So Isla came up with the idea that they really needed to provide more and better quality Scottish entertainment, so they booked such artists as Roddy Brown from the Corries, Gaberlunzie, Peter Morrison, Old Blind Dogs, and subsequently put on a lot of great programs. The society's Burns Suppers attendance grew and its newsletter reached a peak of 400 members at one stage. But there was a significant lack of young people and the older members, inevitably, started to fade away. All the events were held in the Scottish Cultural Centre. She also feels that younger people – that is, children and grandchildren of Scots, etc – do not need the "support" of the centre like their emigrant parents or grandparents sought out, nor do they have a real desire to gather in order to keep hold of a heritage – they are Canadian. Although she feels things like piping and Highland Dancing will keep on growing, she is fearful of the future of small membership groups such as the Moray, Nairn and Banff Society. She goes back to Scotland every year to see her relatives. When speaking of her feelings when going to Scotland, she says she used to feel like they were going home when her parents were there, but now she feels the opposite – her children, on the most part, are in Canada, and so are most of their closest friends. When asked if her feelings of Scottishness grew due to her being in Canada, say states quite bluntly, "No". She does say, however, that she is quite "North-East" in her way of doing things, and they have a lot of Scottish friends, but they also have friends from other places, like Hungary, China, and Kenya, which broadens one's perspective. She does say that she personally feels "rooted" in her Scottishness and thinks that she will never feel fully Canadian. She still eats porridge for breakfast, for example, and her Scottish sweet-tooth is still firmly in place! She enjoys reading Ian Rankin and Sunset Song is a favourite novel. She can't stand Sir Walter Scott.... But her tastes are pretty eclectic. She doesn't enjoy "overwhelmingly Scottish" novels, Rankin is good because he's just a good writer. James MacIntyre Robertson (Granton-on-Spey, 12 January 1936). He started school in Tomintoul in the Cairngorms. He remembers there being a lot of evacuee children from the cities at his school (supposedly as a precaution to escape the bombing) as well as children who had lost their parents. He also remembers a lot of orphaned kids from Glasgow were gathered by the Catholic Church, Catholocized, and sent up to Tomintoul. The majority of people in Tomintoul were Catholic and there was no sectarian animosity in these places like there was/is in Glasgow. People tended to marry into same religion, but there was no segregation when it came to education, etc. He left school at 15 and became a ship-right apprentice in Glasgow. He got 28 shillings a week from the Youth Employment Office to live on. He remembers the shipyards being awash with people. His first job was working on a destroyer around 1951. The personnel officer was a man named MacNeil, who was one of the performers of the popular radio show The Mcflannels. He remembers learning that he was murdered in Govan for being a homosexual. It was MacNeil who urged James to take his Junior National Certificate, so he went to night school at Sholans Academy in order to accomplish this. When back at work, he started making moulds and templates for commercial- and passenger-ships. He finished his apprenticeship, was called up for National Service in the RAF (repairing aircraft), and then was posted to Singapore as a maintenance worker in a confiscated German liner. His was the first commercial ship to go through the Suez Canal after the long years of unrest. He stayed in Singapore for a year and a half before coming back to Scotland on Christmas Day, 1958. He returned to work at Fairfield shipyard. By this time, the first computers were coming out, and they were doing 10-scale drawing. So he was sent to Glasgow University for one day a week to learn computer programming. He also met Isla around this time, and they were married in 1966. They learnt of opportunities in Montreal through newspaper advertisements, and so they emigrated (see Isla's transcript). He worked for Vickers, which was on the French-speaking East Side of Montreal. He then applied for position in Toronto as a loftsman at Douglas Aircraft, he drove back to Montreal every weekend. Then they went back to Scotland and stayed in Port Glasgow for a year, then Paisley, with James working for Lithgows for 4 years. He was then offered a job in Collingwood, Ontario, but the process took too long. He then found out about work at the Vancouver Shipyards, which was just about to begin building the Queen of Alberni. They enjoyed their first year in Vancouver and decided to stay. He worked in many shipyards and ship-related jobs across Canada until his retirement at 65. His father was Edward John Robertson (Duffton, 1895-1985). He was a joiner and was wounded in WWI. He became a postman after the war. His mother was Kristina MacIntyre Robertson (Aberfeldy). She came from a family of 6. 4 bothers became policemen. She went to Tomintoul to work in the hotel.